15 Comments:

At 8:07 AM,  Anonymous said...

Hmmm;

I wonder, was it "racist" when -- during the late 19th and early 20th centuries -- all us low-wage, low-rent Irish types were herded like cattle through Ellis Island? You see, back then, if it was discovered that an immigrant just didn't have what it takes, they were summarily shipped back to Ireland. And there was no swimming across the "pond" and coming in the "back door" during those Titanic times. You were either documented, or "discriminated" against.

But somehow, it's supposed to be different with our little brown brothers south of the border. They can wetback it, and while walking down the street with their clothes still damp, whip out an English version of the Bill of Rights and Constitution (of which they may or may not be able to read ... kinda' like most Louisiana skool chillun) and expect not to get busted for violating immigration law?

Specifically, illegal immigration adds tens-of-billions of dollars a year to the tax-bills of invasion-strapped America. Oh yeah, I know the argument, illegals will do the scut-work that all us more disinfected types refuse to perform. Bullshit. Sustaining an illegal immigration economy is not too different from the European serfdom of old.

Worse, it santions the invasive criminal conduct being committed by a more anonymous brand of immigrant that isn't being vetted for desirability.

This is a circumstance that the global corporations operating in America are using to distract the public with arguments that don't focus on how much the middle-class must pay so the much richer corporate class can exploit all that cheap labor.

But because they're little brown brothers, somehow, their conduct is being advertised as "reasonably" more acceptable. I mean, the humanitaryism of it all.

But the greatest asset (and problem) for the brown-skinned invaders of America's southern border is that they have such a large 5th column of previously wetbacked anchor relatives just north of the border that are all too willing to also flout immigration law so they can economically exploit their own relatives. For the vast majority of illegals, doing it legally isn't even a casual consideration.

So, what are we doing now? We tell our law enforcement that they can't be "profilers" ... at least as far as immigration crooks are concerned. While bankrobbers and "terraists" get profiled, economic invaders are supposed to gat a pass. It's a conundrum that's been designed to be.

DanD

 

At 6:14 PM,  The Sailor said...

DanD, you should be ashamed of your racist, fact free screed.

30% of AZonians are Hispanic heritage Americans, they'll get the same treatment.

Where do you get this figure "Specifically, illegal immigration adds tens-of-billions of dollars a year to the tax-bills of invasion-strapped America."

Next time you use the term "wetback" in any form I'll discuss with my partners about banning you from the site.

 

At 10:43 PM,  Anonymous said...

And Sailor;

Who the fuck appointed you the omnipotent god of Vidiotspeak?

This is a forum that discusses current events without the baggage (at least I thought) of political correctness.

As far as racism is concerned? Every motherfucker on this whole goddam planet is -- to some extent -- a racist ... it's in our genes you dumb assfuck. And if you think that you don't express youself in some racist fashion or at least make that claim, then you're either deluded or a liar.

And anyway, how do you so omnipotently know that the entire 30 percent Hispanic population of Arizona (even those guys who go to work in a suit and tie every day) will automatically be targeted for profiling discrimination because of this law? And if some are, then guess what, they (you know, the jackboots of law-enforcement) don't target them specifically just because their Hispanic, they target them at least as much because they're (ostensibly, at least) Democrats. Check out the Bradblog about this.

In any event, there are also other reasons why they are targeted. And why? Well, maybe because illegal immigrants have been found living in their homes or conducting their business out of them. For the "stick-time" addicts of law-enforcement, maybe they look just a little bit too much like the MILLIONS of river-crossing criminals coming up from south of the border into the United States every year, many for whom the've arrested for robbery, rape, and cop-murder. Arizona is having a special problem with Mexico's drug cartels right now, and while delivering their "commodity," they are also illegal border-crossers.

In the meantime, tell me Sailor, have you ever seen a formerly "white" (or even formerly black) neighborhood that has turned into a low-rent, immigrant barrio of Hispanic economic refugees? That location invariably becomes more than just slightly filthy, and this is a raw-boned fact. When these immigrant-types get finished with a candy bar or Micky-Dee's hamburger and drink, they just throw the trash on the street (or in somebody else's yard) while they're walking, regardless if a trash can is only 25 feet away. Since most of them didn't grow up in a "first-world" nation before, they treat their new neighborhood just like the rubbish heap they've left behind. When I lived in the Philippines, circumstances were similar there, as I did in fact live in the "poorer" quarters for more than a couple of years.

(Continued Below)

 

At 10:44 PM,  Anonymous said...

(continued from above)

Here's one excellent summary of the matter from Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_impact_of_illegal_immigrants_in_the_United_States

Now, if you take the raw data from this article and add it up with other costs such as when impoverished (or even opulent crime-lord types) illegal aliens go on crime sprees, the ultimate costs get especially all collateral and is much more complex to add up ... except that it does always go up:

http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=iic_immigrationissuecenters0b9c

Mostly however, it's the collateral labor-related cost of illegal immigration that balloons tremendously, especially for America's (homegrown and legal immigrant) working class who have found it nearly impossible to maintain an American lifestyle while competing with the "wetbacks" (yeah, I used the pejorative for a specific purpose ... they could be blond-haired blue-eyed Nordic wetbacks and I'd still talk about them like they're the crooks they are) who are used to living like slum-dwellers. How can the working citizen compete or otherwise organize himself for collective bargaining when there is a great surplus of ghost-laborers just waiting at the local hardware store (and elsewhere, for other job descriptions) to get hired for a union-busting moment?

Otherwise, please do go to your other "partners" at the Vidiot and ask them to ban me for representing a very real and fundamental point of view in America. Somehow, I believe that they aren't quite as ideologically bigotted as you are. Epithets are only as terrible as you make them. Look at my many other posts here for when I talk about stupid and ignorant Caucasian folks, I as readily use the terms "cracker," or "Paddy," or somesuch, according to the subject being discussed. It's a literary tactic that's been in use at least since Mark Twain wrote Huckleberry Finn.

In the meantime, you can take your "I'm a discrimination-less more (self)righteous person than you are" attitude and stuff it up you ass.

DanD

 

At 2:15 AM,  Anonymous said...

Additional information regarding America's economic refugee costs:

http://www.usillegalaliens.com/impacts_of_illegal_immigration_economic_costs.html

DanD

 

At 10:06 AM,  The Sailor said...

You first article from Wiki proved my point.

FAIR is a white supremacist organization, no value at all to their opinions. Especially since they commonly lump legal and illegal immigrants together.

And your opinions have absolutely no value at all because they can't be changed by facts.

 

At 10:40 AM,  Anonymous said...

Oh, and the "facts" that you've presented by your own brand of propaganda is the only research worthy of consideration?

And the Wiki article provided two different perspecitves, yet you only sanction one of them? You are as dishonest as the average Louisiana politician. You seem to prefer cherry-picking whatever information is provided.

The primary problem with illegal immigration is that the Federal government has taken a "It's Not Our Problem" attitude about it, except when that government "authoritatively" creates unfunded mandates that the States must then allocate for from already staained budgets.

Also as it is, government propaganda from both sides of the realm seems to be skewed. So, which do you prefer to believe? I know what I see as a resident of Southern California, Los Angeles County.

Now, I live in what's called a "Mixed Neighborhood." Yet, when I go to the local free clinic about my deteriorating health, As often as not, I'm about the only Caucasian there. perhaps, maybe two or three others are Black. Among the rest 20-to-30 patients waiting, the vast majority are non-English-speaking Hispanics. If you want to accuse me of profiling, yep, you're right. And you don't?

In the meantime, I've stated many facts in my "screed" above. I've also provided a variety of links showing both sides of the argument. You've provided (in your next screed on the main page) one link that reads like an assassination hit piece on selected FAIR articles.

And then you deifically declare that all I say or may express has absolutely no value.

Fuck you too.

Tell me Sailor, who are you gatekeeping at the Vidiot website for?

DanD

 

At 4:51 PM,  The Vidiot said...

First of all, EVERYBODY is a racist. EVERYBODY. We all accept dominant Eurocentric values, the idea that white middle class values are dominant is unquestioned and seems normal, natural and inevitable. What if the tables were turned? What if the society was run based on say, indigenous values, put them in positions of power and surrender our white positions, and let them make the rules. Where their culture becomes dominant and our culture becomes marginalized and becomes folk art. Beethoven would become this cute little white people thing. Not so comfortable to think of. And we expect everyone to uphold our white values? Racism is embedded in the consciousness of every human being. Racism is as an embedded, multidimensional and multi-level aspect of all of our social institutions. For anyone to say “I’m not racist.” means, really, they’re full of shit. We all are racist, even our most ‘liberal’ brethren.

And while I don’t approve (or totally disapprove I should say) of Dan’s use of the term “wetback,” it is our reaction to that word that gives it power. The word itself has no real power, we GIVE it that power to ruffle our feathers, to upset us, to offend us. (Though, I might remind Dan that this blog was started by a lady and she would prefer that comments don’t descend into profanity... Unless she starts it... In which case that would be fine... Or so she tells me.)

The problem is that so-called liberals want to tolerate other people, still keep them subordinate mind you, but tolerate them. The so-called conservative doesn’t patronize other people by tolerating them. They just flat-out, no-holds-barred subordinate them. Either way, the “other” is marginalized and white power marches on.

As far as Arizona goes, frankly, we stole it from the Mexicans. They should be given back control of that State, they should change all the signage to Spanish, they should swap out all the art in the museums with their own indigenous art and put the white people’s art in the folk museum, start conducting all education in Spanish, make white people read Mexican literature, blast Mexican music on all the radio stations, make English speakers have to press 2 to continue in English etc. and so forth.

Seriously though, my real concern about the Arizona situation is that it will be used to create a need for a national ID system. THAT would suck. This whole kerfuffle is being manufactured by the powers that be, complete with infighting and silly dichotomous distractions. They’re just using the specter of “the other” to pull it off.

 

At 7:17 PM,  Anonymous said...

Mea Culpa to the Vidiot regarding the profanity ...

... but the Sailor was patronizing me -- and threatening me with his fantastic powers of Vidiot-insider persuasion -- for employing "liberally" unpopular words while ignoring HOW I was using them. My intent was to break away from the Capitalist Party's opportunistically manipulated "left/right" politically correct paradigm of how all us hoi polloi are supposed to limit our ability to debate. This is much in the same vein as to how the word "anti-Semite" is used to bludgeon anybody who even remotely questions Zionland's G_d-given right to commit genocide against all the non-Jewish Semites of Palestine. Well, I wasn't going to play the Sailor's stupid little "liberal masters of the universe" game of self-deification. Consequently, profanity functions suitably enough for that purpose.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/wetback

Anyway, unlike such commonly vulgar words as "shit" and "fuck," the word "wetback" IS in the dictionary. It's commonly used to identify criminally invading tresspassers who are violating a particular international border. The term "illegal immigrant" is the politically correct version of the above definition.

What I mostly want to know is, why are the illegal invaders from the south of the U.S. border automatically given a pass on crimial motive simply because their petty malicious conduct is more in the line of economic exploitation? In that the primary victim of exploitation is the entire legal workforce of the United States, the economic and political decline that these fiscal huns have caused throughout entire social structure of middle, North America has been a long time accumulating, at least since the end of WWII.

One thing I do know, from the outset of its economically unequal beginnings, "Illegal Immigrant" issue was also composed and developed as a political wedge of cultural divisiveness. Whenever the power-elite needs an appropriate diversion from more important matters (such as internationally criminal warmongering), then optionally, (from among other even less important subjects of national diversion, e.g. abortion) the civil war of "illegal immigration" is ratcheted up into a violent frenzy as a corporate media hot topic.

So, Washington allows the economic Visigoths of Mexico, et-al, to regularly steal a socially more conscious opportunity of self-advancement from the lowest class of wage earners of Middle-America in order to perpetuate and even expand this political football.

Sigh.

DanD

 

At 9:08 PM,  The Sailor said...

I wish Bill could have come in here at some point.

But since this has become a zero sum game, DanD wins, I lose, I resign.

 

At 9:12 PM,  The Sailor said...

But thanks for all the fish.

 

At 9:32 PM,  The Sailor said...

BTW, my main point in the post was that
American citizens will have to show papers to any cop in AZ that asks for them, and the cops are required by the law to ask, else they can be sued.

Gosh, if that law was instituted in NY who knows what would happen.

 

At 2:19 AM,  Anonymous said...

And this is where the law is not so mandatory ... cause I know that if an Arizona cop ever asked me for my papers, I'd ask him why'd he wants to see them.

If you ever looked at me, or heard me speak, or saw the way I dressed, there's absolutely no way this side of hell that I could ever be suspected of not being a United States citizen.

As it is, reasonable suspicion is still the hallmark of lawful investigation, and the cops are yet required to ask only if there is reasonable evidence to suspect.

Indeed, cops will probably abuse this law, as they do a great number of other laws. If law enforcement were smart (whooboy), they would only target non-English speakers and other cultural anomoly misfits. Yup, it's unfair ... but not addressing the problem is even more unfair to the working poor (including legal immigrant workers) who are most seriously affected by the lower-wage, economic hardhships of un(der)-employment that results from the job-market thefts committed by criminally "undocumented" workers.

And I'm with you Sailor on needing the input of Bill, I'm kinda' wondering if he's okay as I haven't seen a post from him for a while. has anybody here heard from him lately?

The piss-poor job that WDC has done on the circumstance of immigration security is what has caused America's current problem of millions of immigration scoff-laws literally thumbing their nose at that same government from which they're demanding employment rights that simply do not exist.

Now, Arizona is trying to at least force the Federal government's hand into taking responsibility. Personally, I think that Arizona's extreme brashness is probably the best motivation possible to get Washington to either pee or get off the imigration security pot. Anything more luke warm would only elicit a luke warm (non-)response.

As it is, the corporations that make the most "bling" from undocumented workers still rule this roost.

DanD

 

At 1:01 PM,  Bill Arnett said...

Sorry for my extended absence, guys, but I have desperately been trying to live through the awful, deleterious side effects of many new meds they had me on. It got so bad that my laptop felt like a brick in hand and I was the monkey trying to figure out this curious anomaly. I have started that book, DanD, more than a dozen times but after 100 pages or so everything written looked like spaghetti.

I have been trying to follow the thread here, but it seems to me that you are arguing OPINIONS more so than the facts (Opinion: The moon is beautiful tonight versus Ugh! It looks like crap to me; you can't win. Facts are entirely arguable: The moon is 225,000 miles from earth versus I'm sorry, you are mistaken for at this time of year it is 240,000 miles away; have at it.

I lean towards the musings of the Vidiot in that all people are prejudiced and/or racist to various degrees ranging fro so mild it is never spoken of to wild-eyed, red-faced, spittle-slinging ranting.

Please don't allow yourself to slip right over the ledge into wild argument with personally directed animosity and such foul language. Frankly I believe you do yourself more harm pursuing that path, Dan, instead of just sticking to the facts. Rousing debate is wonderful, but you will never win anyone over when such language becomes prevalent. Just agree to disagree, but without being personally disagreeable.

I shared my current health status with only one other person here on the site and I appreciate their tact and diplomacy in not violating my privacy by making any comment referencing it in any way. I think I'm almost back now, 'though it took me a lo-o-o-n-n-n-g time to hunt and peck this comment. I will very, very soon be back; it's always my hands and vision, especially my hands, that bear the brunt of vicious side-effects. In the lat 16 years I have had full sensory perception, dexterity, and/or use of my hands for maybe five years. This time was particularly harsh and cruel, but I swear I will make a comeback soon. Now I have to lay down and rest.

 

At 6:17 PM,  Unknown said...

See what happens Bill? You take an extended leave and shit falls apart.

You may wait for a little while until you feel easy enough before reading the book so you can comfortably follow it's time-line trek. I've tried reading clever books before when I was ill, and it only made me more ill.

I know I'm getting old Bill, 'cause nowadays when I perceive a personal slight (real or imagined), I will get a tad belligerent.

If that is the case Sailor (and I'll let you be the judge), then I offer my apology.

DanD

 

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